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HomeMy WebLinkAbout1992/01/29 - Minutes - PC-HPCCITY OF RANCHO CUCAMONGA CITY COUNCIL MINUTES Joint Me,*~n~ of the CiW Co-ncil ~nd Plnnni~ Commi.~ion A. CAI.I. TO ORBi~.R The City Council of the City of Rancho Cucamonga met at 6:30 p.m. on Wednesday, January 29, 1992, for an Executive Session to discuss pending litigation in the Sernno Room of the Civic Center. The Executive Session was recessed at 7:20 to the scheduled joint meeting of the Rancho Cucamonga City Council and Planning Commission in the Rains Conference Room of the Civic Cents, !ocat~ at 10500 Civic Center Drive, Rancho Cucamonga, California. The meeting was called to order at 7:24 p.m. by Mayor Dennis L. Stout. Present were Councilmembers: William J. Alexands, Diane Williams, Pamela J. Wright (arrived at 7:27 p.m.), and Mayor Dennis L. Stout. Absent was Councilmember:. Charles J. Buquet H. Present were Planning Commissionera: S-Tnnne Chitiea, John Melcher, Wendy Valletw, and Chairman Larry McNiel. Absent was Commissioner:. Peter Tolstoy. Also present were: Jack Lain, City Manager;, Jerry B. Fulwood, Deputy City Manager;, Rick Gomez, Community Development Director, Brad Bullet, City Planner;, Otto Ktoutil, Deputy City Planhen Dan Coleman, Principal Planner, Lan7 Henderson, Principal Planner, Joe O'Neil, City Engineer;, Shinto Bo~, Deputy City Engineer, and Jan Sutton, Deputy City Clerk. R. JOINT IT!~.M~ O!~ BIRCIIS~ION Jack Lam, City Mana~r, slated there was a request to add an item at the end of the agenan to approve a resolution that would allow the City to apply for a grant application. B1. CITY PO~ .ICY VIS-A-VI~ H~USIN~ M1X AND HOUSINC, OU~,I .ITY Commissioner Melcher stated he had ask~ for this item to be on the agentin du~ to issues that were raised with the recent U.S. Homes project, where the developer tequesl~d smaller lot sizes, and how this affected the Etiwanda Specific Plan. He felt that the development occun~g in the Etiwanda area seems to be missing the point of the City Council/Planning Commission Joint Meeting Minutes January 29, 1992 Page 2 Etiwanda Specific Plan, and does not seem to have the quality envisioned for the Etiwanda area. He stated there is also some concern by members of the Commission about smaller lot subdivisions looking very crowded. He stated the Commission has been discussing the possibility of requiring mote modest houses. He stated they then started to discuss what are they trying to do with housing, and the concern wu raised that if you do something modest uxlay, it could be the blighted area of the future. Councilmember Wright arrived at 7:27 p.m. Commissioner Melcher stauxl the question was does the City have any set of goals or ambitions for the housing mix and quality other than those set in the General Plan, or should the Commission be encouraging the largest house compatible with the lot size instead of going with a more motlest type of house. Councilmember Alexander asked what was their definition of "modest." Commissioner Melcher stated they wen looking at having a smaller scale of house on the lot instead of having a Large, chunky two-story house filling tip eveaT possible inch allowed. lie staled modest did not nec__e-ssarily refer to a less expensive house, that they wotdd still be quality built homes. Councilmember Alexander felt it was a good idea, and agreed ~at "modest" did not have to be eq,,~,~ to the cost. Chairman McNiel stated what started this discussion is that it is consim~t in Ihe development cornmtmity to use the maximum amount of square footage nilowed for the footlaint of the house, so you end up with a minimum amount of setbacks and a very large sln~cmre consuming the lot, which does not create an ideal view for a neighbor and looks just like row housing. lie stated a counterpoint would be to look at communities to the west that were new 15-20 yean ago comprised of what could be consideml modest housing, and what they look like now. Councilmember Wright stated that from a lay person's point of view, she had always assumed the size of the house was market driven in the City, as is the lot size. She felt lhat people wanted the large houses built on the small lots because they did not have the tlme to take care of a larger loc C~rnmissi~ner Chitien stated part ~f that may be true~ and part ~f it w~uld he t~ realize the m~st pr~~t fr~m the ~and by the developer, but that ideas my chan~e. She stated that the developers have continmdly wanted to build larger and larger homes, so when the Commission uppmved some of the smaller lots, the idea was to provide a mix of housing with a smaller home being built on the smaller lot. She asked when should the Commission start saying they have a policy that a certain number of houses in a tract should have a sanadler footprint, and felt the Commission needed a policy from the Council on the ~ in moving in that direction. Commissioner VaHeue stated currently what they see are two-story homes on yen/minimal lots, which just seems as a way of amassing housing producL Mayor Smut felt the kind of housing lhey are describing is being built in a number of communities in the area, and felt the reason Rancho Cucamonga was successful with that type of home as opposed to the others is because Rancho Cucarnonga provides a more mumin/oriented phikMmphy in their planning, so instead of concentrating a lot of effort into the lot itself, they have put a lot of effort into the environment around it. They are seeing the results of that philosophy, and he did not feel that was _nece__-ssarfiy bad. lie agreed with Commjs~oner Melcher that the Etiwanda Specific Plan did not do what anyone wanted it to do. It was too dense for a country nlmosphere, but not dense enough for the developers, and that was why it did not work. City Council/Planning Commission Joint Meeting Minutes January 29, 1992 Page 3 Councilmember Alexander ~ if the Commission was just concerned with the Etiwanda area. Commissioner Melther stated no, but that is what gave rise to the question. He stated the Commission had discussed that there were things they could do with their otdinstr. es to create a less dense look, but it would push house sizes down which might cazam a product that the market does not want He felt Mayor Stout's comments were helpful. Commissioner VaHette staled she was concerned because she sees a ~_n_;.~n developing where the developen are using the maximum lot coverage with minimum set-backs, and in some tracts that is leaving only enough room between driveways for one cat to park. She did not feel that was good for the community, and would not be providing them with a quality environment. Mayor Stout felt they should not misinteal~ret what he said, that he believed there were opportunities to come up with different types of product or set-backs, etc., to achieve a diffffent type of look. Councilmanbet Willlares thought there were very few small houses available in Use community and felt they would sell qttickly if builL She stated she would ~ to ~ the developers to have a mix of housing styles. Commissioner Chitlea stated they could do that but it would be yea7 different f~om their previous direction, and feli they needed to discuss Ibis before making any big changes. Councilmember Wright stated she would Like to see something different. that she did not like the look of row housing, but felt the lot size was really the issue and how the cost of land in the City affected that. She felt those were Planning Commission issues, and that when a developer comes with a plan, they could see that there is variety in the tiesip. Councilmanbet Willlares felt if saneone was creative, they could have the density but sffil achieve a different look Mayor Stout staled one problem with having a single s~ory house was that it would need a larger footprint and would not fit on some of the lot sixes. Councilmanbet Willjams fell there wae people who were looking for quality homes that were not nec__essarily large Mayor Stout felt that in past develolsment~ the single-sto~ houses were Use last to sell when mixed with two-story houses. He thought maybe it would be belter to have a develol~ent of just single-story homes instead of n'ying to mix them. Chairman McNiel stated the Commission has been discussing the feasibility of requiring a small percentage of a developmet to be single-slnT. He felt as far as lot size, you couki have the same problem with a 7,000 square foot lot as yon would wi~h a 3,000- 5,000 scluate foot lot, in terms of side yard, or having one flat straight wall to carry the load since it is the cheapest me~bod of consmlction. He stated the Cummission was in a quandaty on whether to start demanding some single-family homes in a tract. or a whole tract of single-story houses, or whether it was even a good idea or not. Commissioner Cltitiea stated the ~ was if it was better to put single-family detached homes on small lots or to have the same munber of units clustered in multi-family developments, because there were very different philosophical trends in,;,olved with Ixxh. She stated there were also some differences of opinion in the Commission on what is appropriate to have adjacent to the freeway and that it will maintain its quality. City Council/Planning Commission Joint Meeting Minutes January 29, 1992 Page 4 Brad Butler, City Planner, stated every year the Commission works on its work program, and for the first time they are seeing a lot of Iracts built in this grander style that appear very cramped. AL~o. mere has been a respite in applications for single-fam~y developments, and they felt now was a good time to raise this issue. They wanted to make the Council aware that they will be dealing with this issue more during the next year, and on defining how the product should fit into the streetscape. Councilmember Willjams asked if they were making sure that developers were designing ways to access R V parking in the hack yard. Chairman McNiel stated they are looking at requiting 15% as a reasoutble amount. Brad Buller, City Planner, stated the new direction would be to get as many homes as poss~le designed to allow RV parking in the back yan:l. Chairman McNiei stated the trend will probably be to go to some single-stop/units and pulling in of the side yard, which will bring down the sale price of the house, so there will probably be developers who come to the Council to The Council and Commission discussed various styles and ways of introducing single-stoP/homes into th~ community. B2. COMMISSION I~P. SPONSmn.ITY. CITY PROJI:.CTS Commissioner Mekher stated in the Design Review process, the Commission concenlrates on the conununity face of a project, what people see when they drive by places they might not normally go into. He slated with a public project that will be used by the citizens of the community, be thought aH of the space within that project should also be subject to review. His thought was that the City's projects would benefit by increasing the Planning Commission's involvement in the development of them. He felt design involved a lot more other than the superficial coating of the building. Mayor Stout stated the Council has had concerns about this issue. He slated if a someone wants to build something, they have architects and engineers to help intalxt, t theit desires as the owner into a building, hot the bottom line is that the owner is the customer, and slill owns the building and is involved in the process. He felt that on City projects, the Council, acting as the representatives of the community, would be considered the customer and thus should be more involved in the pmjecL He stated the way the process is set up now, last a certain point the Council has not been as involved as he thought they should be as the customer. Commissioner Melther felt the Council, or a subcommittee of the Council, should be involved and present each time the Planning Commi~_eio~ is considering a public project, and have equal input into the process. Councilmember Williams felt they could set a policy on this in motion vep/easily. Councilmember Wright sated in the past they have always stayed out of a project when it goes to the Planning Commission, and at that point is when they have felt out of control of the projecL Mayor Stout stated they needed to be canful because the Planning Commi~eion is appointed by the Council, so they cannot be involved in a double dealing si_nt~eiea wbere they are not getling an honest opinion from the Commission. City Council/Planning Commission Joint Meeting Minutes Jnnusry 29, 1992 Pn~e 5 Councilmember Wright agreed, and felt if they went with a team appmsch, then input could be given from both sides eariy on soev~ryon~couldundffstm~whycenainconclusimss~er~ached- Councilmember Williams concurmi Commissioner Chitlea felt that from the Planning Commission side, if they we~ involved eartier on in the design process, they might have an opp0utunity to suggest appmln'ia~ or creative chsnges before it was too !ate. The Council and Commission di.~c,a~d hew SOllie Of the major public buildings have been designed and executed recently. Mayor Stout felt having a subcommitu~ involved in the l~ocess would be good, with ~ to me full Council on ar~guisrhasis. Chairman McNiel stated the reason this i~m was on the agentIn was because the Planning Commission is rarely involved in interior space design for any of the facilities, and felt if they had a subcommittee also, they might be able to make suggestions on more efficient uses of the spsce. Councilmember Alexander felt it was aH right to raise questions, but they had to keep in mind that neither th~ Council nor Commission wes~ space efficiency experts. Commissioner Melcher stated they just want~l to be able to questions or challenge, to make sur~ the experts are doing what was need~ B3. ROU'I~- 30 Commissioner Vallette slatod she had requesled this iRm in order to give a brief update to the Council from the Phnning Commission's percep~m. She stated on lantmry 27, 1991, she and Commissioner Tolstoy auended a meeting with Councilmembers Buquet and Willisms, Caltnns tt~tesenm,ves and City staff. She sta2d a lot of concerns we~ di.~cvssed, and felt they had a beuer !x-slx~ve now as to what to expect from the freeway. She stated topics discussed. She stsed the Phnning Comwl,sloo's subconunittee for Rose 30 openstes under direction of the Council and the policy set by Council. She felt it was important to have the Commission's subcommittee sound attenuation walls. She asked if the Council desired any input by or about the Commission's subcommittee, or if they had any questions. Councilmember Willjams sta2d it was an excellent meeting, and asked staff what was the decision on the sound attenuation walls. Brad Bullet, City Planner, stated stuff undenmod that Calmms was now requiring mote acceptance on the wails, so staff was going to pursue the issue with CadInns to get some type of policy in writing from them. Mayor Stout stated the City needed to come up with some way to pay for the walls up front to ensure they could pay for them when Calltans works out all of their requL, zments, in case the state no longer has she funds to pay for them. City Council/Phnning Commission 1oint Meeting Minutes lanuary 29, 1992 Page6 The Council and Commission discussed the current tmdusmnding of the sound attenuation requirements by Calltans. Chairman McNiel stated the Commission's subcommittee was set up to keep the Commission aware of changes involved in the freeway so they would know how to handle projects that were adjacent to it, not to help design it. Mayor Stout stated one problem they are having now is tat the City is being pressured into making decisions about infrastructure that is adjacent to the freeway, in that when they condition a developer to do something in that area, because Calu'ans has not set their work for the freeway yet, the City is having to excuse developers from their conditions. He stated theY need to he awse of these things and keep communicalion ope~. Councilmember Willtams stated the agreement was to have meetings with Calu'ans on a regular basis about the B4. STATUS OF RI~,GIONAI- MAT.T. Brad Bulls', City Planner, stated this was brought up because the Commission has not seen much of the design status of the mall lately. Commissioner Mekher stated there is some coneelm, that the Agency is moving along with plans for site development at a umuendous invesunent of money, and the developers of the mall appear to he giving the impression of holdinS off until the last minute for apptov~ of the design, where the City will he pressed to mnirlng aa approval just to keep things moving. He thought the Commission would like assurances that the developer is being reminded to allow plenty of time in their schedule for design review. Mayor Stout staled it is common for a developer to come in at the last moment for a mall project, and they could not really control that. He thought the Commission needed to commit to the idea that this project will neext a tremendous mount of attention in a very short time span, that they would not he able to go through the normal pmc~s, and might have to delay some other projects in order to gct this one done in a timely manner when it was submitted. He felt staff has pushed the developer to keep the City appraised of the ptugress, which has not always Commissioner Chittea ~-_d they did expect some changes based on the ~uidity of the project, but stated they have been waiting for more than a year and a half for another meeling on the conceptual duign. Mayor Stout stated it will he a challenge to the Conunission when the developer says they are relty to go, and he felt they would have to work out desigu issues as quickly as possible, that there will not he the luxury of time for B5. nlSCUSSInN OF ITF, Mg OF MUTU,4L nN"F~PST Chairman McNiel stated the Commi-_~i_'oo has been apptt~ched for a freeway sign for a shopping center. He stated they have approximately six opporumitles for freeway signs, and as the requests come in, each development will feel that their sign needs to he grander than the last one. He asked what was the CouncH's opinion on freeway signs. City Council/Planning Commission Ioint Me~ting Minutes Ianuary 29, 1992 Page 7 Jack Lain, City Manager, stared when the sign ordinance was develq~ed, the issue of freeway signs was cllac,,.o. sed but there was no development in that area yet, so it was agreed tht the City would deal with freeway signs when that time arrived. He stated there was no detailed discussion on how large, or how many users should be on one, etc. He stated thin was also a provision placed in the ordinance for regional shopping centers that when the site was approved, the sign would he by special approval of the Planning Commission. Chairman McNiel felt that freeway signs have been misused in other communities and he did not want to see that happen in Rancho Cucamongn. Mayor Stout stated the primary purpose of a sign is to benefit the public by allowing them to find what they arc locking for, but he felt they also needed to keep the signs tasteful and of a reasonable size. He also felt they needed to be reasonable as far as how many businesses they allow to be listed on the sign. Councilmember Williams felt that people could determine what type of mailer stores were in a center based upon the majors, and felt it would be all right for the nmjor stores to hav~ their names on a sign but not every store in the Brad Buller, City Planner, mated that each shopping center had Ihe right to request a sign program. He stared that in the case of Foothill Marketplace, its orientalion to the freeway was such that it would not have good visibility to time' tmffic on the freeway, so they wanted to be sm to have a sign that served them. The Council and Commission discussed the types of signs they would like to see on the freeway as far as su~ctm~ The Council and Commission discussed the selection process used in Rancho Cucamonga to select Planning Commission members, and concurred that it was good the way it was with general selection by the entire Council as opposed to each Councilmember selecting one Commissioner. Mayor Stout stated he would like the Commission and Council to be concerned with envisioning things they would like to see in the community ten or ~fS~en years from now. He felt with all the attention they have had to pay to cm-rent affain, there has not always been time for looking ahead. He stated his feelings stem from the realization of how long it takes to accompli~ something, so if yon did not start planning now for fuun~ projects, they might not ever happen. Jack Lain, City Manager, stated there was the possibility for a grant application, and in order to submit the application, a resolution would need to be apptoved to allow the City to apply for the granL Mayor Stout stated in order to add an emergency item to the agentin, it would need the affmtmtive vote of all Councilmembers presenL MOTION: Moved by Wright, seconded by Alexander to add an Environmental !~-q~cement and Mitigation Program for Grant A-~sf, um'e item to the agends. Motion carried unstimously, 4-0-1 (Buquet absent). B6. P, PPROVP, t- OF ~ FII-IN~, OF AN P, PPI.ICATION FOR ~ ~.NVIRONMF-NTAI. F. NI-IANCF. MI~NT ANT} MITI~,ATION PROflRAM FOR GRANT A~SL{IT,0,N('~-: CI=-RTIFY THAT TI-1F. P, PPI.ICATION W~ J. MAR~ Ar}!~OUAT~- PROVL~It~NS FOR OP~&TION ANn MAINTF-NANC~. OF PROJF. CT: ANT~ APPOfNT ~ CITY F. NGINF. I~R TO CONnUCT ,s,~ J. NI=F'd3TIATIONS ANT} SURM1T ~[ .l . rS3CUMF..NTS WHICH MAY IIF. NI:.CK{zSP, RY Ff)R ~ COM1q .F. TION OF ~ PROJ1;CT City Council/Planning Commission Joint Meeting Minutes January 29, 1992 Page 8 RESOLUTION NO. 92-018 A RESOLUTION OF THE CITY COUNCIL OF THE CITY OF RANCHO CUCAMONGA, CALIFORNIA, APPROVING THE APPLICATION FOR GRANT FUNDS FOR THE ENVIRONMENTAL ENHANCEMENT AND MITIGATION PROGRAM UNDER THE SECTION 164.56 OF THE ST1~F-PTS AND HIGHWAYS CODE 1989 FOR THE ROCHESTER AVENUE - RANCHO CUCAMONGA FIIGH SCHOOL MITIGATION PROGRAM MOTION: Moved by Alexander, seconded by Willjams to approve Resolution No. 92-018. Motion carried unanimously, 4-0-1 (Buqmt absent). C, COMMUNICATIf)N,~ FRfiM THE PUR!.IC No communications were made fxom the public. n. ADJOIIRN3tRNT MOTION: Moved by Willjams. seconded by Alexander to adjourn. Motion canled unanimously. 4-0-1 CBuquet absent). The meeting adjolnned at 9:15 p.m. Jan Smxo~ Approved by Phuming Commission: Felna~ 7.6, 1992 Appmved by Cky Counc~: March 4, 1992