HomeMy WebLinkAbout1996/04/10 - Workshop Minutes - PC-HPC CITY OF RANCHO CUCAMONGA
PLANNING COMMISSION MINUTES
Adjourned Meeting
April 10, 1996
Chairman Barker called the Adjourned Meeting of the City of Rancho Cucamonga Planning
Commission to order at 6:00 p.m. The meeting was held in the Rains Room at the Rancho
Cucamonga Civic Center, 10500 Civic Center Drive, Rancho Cucamonga, California. Chairman
Barker led the pledge of allegiance.
ROLL CALL
COMMISSIONERS: PRESENT: David Barker, Heinz Lumpp, Larry McNiel, John Melcher, Peter
Tolstoy
ABSENT: None
STAFF PRESENT: Brad Buller, City Planner; Scott Murphy, Associate Planner
ANNOUNCEMENTS
There were no announcements.
OLD BUSINESS
A. CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT 95-16 - SACRED HEART CATHOLIC CHURCH - A discussion
of the bells to be used at a church facility and school on a 20.14 acre site in the Very Low
Residential designation (1-2 dwelling units per acre) of the Etiwanda Specific Plan, located on
the west side of Etiwanda Avenue, between Summit and Highland Avenues - APN: 225-171-12,
20, 22, and 23.
Scott Murphy, Associate Planner, presented the staff report. He also presented two bell schedule
alternatives for the Planning Commission's consideration: Alternative I eliminating the 1/4- and
3/4-hour strike, Alternative 2 eliminating the 1/4- and 3/4-hour strikes and terminated the bells at
6:00 p.m.
Father Gaglia indicated that there was really only one issue for discussion. He observed that the
bells, with one minor adjustment, can comply with the Noise Ordinance. He felt the issue of whether
the bells should be allowed falls under the First Amendment of the Constitution and is not really an
issue-the church has the right to play the bells. In the interest of working with the community. He
said the church believes that Alternate I provided by staff is acceptable.
Mike Cocknell, 12966 Cherokee, Rancho Cucamonga. spoke about the impact varying decibel
readings will have.
Commissioner Melcher asked for an explanation of the decibel levels allowed within the residential
zone.
Mr. Murphy explained that the Noise Ordinance allows noises to exceed the base levels if the
camulative time does not exceed cedain time limits. For example, noise not exceeding five minutes
in an hour may exceed the base level by 14 decibels which would allow the noise level to reach
74 dBA compared to the 60 dBA base level.
Commissioner Melcher asked if staff is able to determine which times are not in compliance with the
Noise Ordinance.
Mr. Murphy responded that staff is not able to identify violations at this time and extensive readings
would have to be conducted before an assessment could be made. He noted that environmental
factors can affect the readings from one day to the next and the same reading could not be assumed
at the same location at the same time.
Commissioner Tolstoy stated that humidity can have a big impact on the readings.
Commissioner Lumpp asked Father Gaglia to identify when the bells are played.
Father Gaglia explained the timing of the bells between 6:00 a.m. and 8:00 p.m.
Commissioner Tolstoy asked if the church could move the Angelus from 6:00 a.m. to 7:00 a.m.
Father Gaglia stated that was not the traditional Angelus time of 6:00 a.m., 12:00 p.m., and
6:00 p.m.
Commissioner Tolstoy asked if any of the bells from the church are used for the school.
Father Gaglia indicated that few of the bells are used for both purposes.
Commissioner Tolstoy asked if the church would eliminate the 1/2-hour strike.
Father Gaglia stated that the Parish Council had met and determined that Alternative 1 is
acceptable, eliminating the 1/4- and 3/4-hour strikes.
Mr. Cocknell submitted a survey for the Planning Commission's consideration. He surveyed the
neighborhood within a 1/4-mile radius of the church. He said the majority of homeowners preferred
the bells on Sunday only or at mass times.
Father Gaglia stated that Chickasaw Street was not included in the survey.
Mr. Cocknell responded that it was not within a 1/4-mile radius.
Marcia Diaz, 6242 Colony Court, Rancho Cucamonga, stated that she had spoken with a neighbor
who was within the 1/4-mile radius and in support of the bells.
Chairman Barker stated that the honesty of the survey was not the issue. He said the Commission
needs to determine if a solution is possible. Chairman Barker indicated that bells on Sundays did
not seem to be a problem. Also, he felt hourly bells were acceptable to the Commission.
Father Gaglia reiterated his concern that the church has a right to play bells and that they can
comply with the Noise Ordinance.
Chairman Barker asked for discussion amongst the Commissioners.
Commissioner McNiel asked what scale of measurement was used in the Noise Ordinance data.
Mr. Murphy responded that the "A weighted" scale was used.
PC Adjourned Minutes -2- April 10, 1996
Commissioner McNiel asked why St. Peter and St. Paul does not play bells.
Father Gaglia stated that the system St. Peter and St. Paul uses is a much older system and parts
are difficult to come by. He said maintenance of the system is very costly.
Brad Buller, City Planner, stated that there is also a neighborhood issue with the bells in addition to
the maintenance issue.
Janine Tibbetts, 12997 Shasta Court, Rancho Cucamonga, stated that St. Peter and St. Paul has
homes much closer than Sacred Heart.
Mr. Cocknell felt that most residents would not have a problem if the 60 dBA base level was met.
Chairman Barker asked if that included seven days a week.
Mr. Cocknell stated that he received a variety of answers.
Father Gaglia indicated that the church properly is nearly 1/4-mile in length north-to-south and east-
to-west.
Commissioner McNiel stated that this is a residential neighborhood. He said bells were originally
used to serve a function and purpose but now the bells are simply tradition. He felt if tradition
intrudes, the City will have a problem. He stated that if this were any other type of application, there
would be no discussion of the bells. He observed that St. Peter and St. Paul's bells do not ring and
no damage has been done to the church. He felt the use of bells is difficult to suppod in any
significant fashion and the problem will continue to grow.
Commissioner Melcher stated he was opposed to any regulation of the bells. He stated bells do not
make noise, they make music. He felt the church has a Constitutional right to play their bells. He
noted the church had offered to accept Alternative 1 and he thought the Commission should snatch
up the opportunity and be done with it.
Commissioner Tolstoy agreed that the church has a right to use bells. However, he thought the
church must be sensitive to the neighborhood. He felt that Alternative 1 could be supported with the
elimination of the 1/2-hour strike. Commissioner Tolstoy was sorry to hear the church would not
move the Angelus to 7:00 a.m. but said he would, however, accept 6:00 a.m.
Commissioner Lumpp asked how anyone could accept the crowing of a rooster or the barking of a
dog but not bells. He noted the survey suggests that bells are acceptable on Sunday when most
people are home asleep. He thought that during the week, the bells would play when most people
are at work. He felt the City should not regulate the bells but noted Alternative 1 was acceptable to
the church. He added that the hymns should be reduced to 3 minutes instead of the 7-1/2 minutes.
He could support elimination of the 1/2-hour strike if the other Commissioners agreed.
Chairman Barker stated that he personally had no use for hymns. He felt the hour strike was
acceptable. While he could appreciate the church's position, he believed that if a church opened
across the street and played bongoes that no one would understand. He noted two Commissioners
supported Altemative I and he asked Commissioner Tolstoy if he could live with the 1/2-hour strike.
Commissioner Tolstoy stated he would not like it.
Chairman Barker stated that if Commissioner Tolstoy said yes, the Commission would have the three
votes necessary for passage; if not, it appeared the vote would be two in favor of Alternative 1, two
in favor of Alternative I with the elimination of the 1/2-hour strike, and one no.
PC Adjourned Minutes -3- April 10, 1996
Commissioner Lumpp indicated he could go along with Chairman Barker and Commissioner Tolstoy
for Alternative 1 with the elimination of the 1/2-hour strike.
Commissioner Melcher reiterated his opposition to regulating the bells.
Chairman Barker asked for a motion.
Mr. Buller indicated that minute action would suffice. He recapped the vote as Chairman Barker and
Commissioners Lumpp and Tolstoy in favor of Alternative 1 with the elimination of the 1/2-hour
strike, Commissioners McNiel and Melcher opposed, but for different reasons.
Commissioner Tolstoy said that the church needs to live within the neighborhood.
Commissioner McNiel felt the bells would be an intrusion into the neighborhood.
Commissioner Melcher stated that the City should not regulate the bells.
Chairman Barker stated that the church or the neighbors would have the ability to appeal the
decision to the City Council.
Mr. Buller asked the church if they would notify staff on their plans for the appeal so they could notify
the residents if questioned.
Father Gaglia stated that the church has compromised and wanted to know if the church can file
complaints about barking dogs in the neighborhood.
Chairman Barker indicated that any complaints may be filed through the proper channels.
PUBLIC COMMENTS
There were no public comments.
COMMISSION BUSINESS
There was no Commission business.
ADJOURNMENT
The meeting was adjourned at 6:50 p.m.
Respectfully submitted,
Brad Buller
Secretary
PC Adjourned Minutes -4- April 10, 1996